11/3/08

The Wrestler's Transition to Jiu-Jitsu

The last few days I have been wondering what it is that makes a wrestler's transition to the Jiu-Jitsu game so uniquely successful. This is sparked mostly by our discussion of Cael Sanderson being on our poll for the best Jiu-Jitsu fighter and actually getting votes. While I realize these votes are likely tongue-in-cheek, we can only imagine that if he trained how good he would be. If nothing else, his submission defense would be exceptional, if nothing else because he would be near impossible to control, to get dominant position on. I'm reminded of how Randy Couture went to a stalemate in a grappling match with Jacare.

The wrestler's transition to Jiu-Jitsu is interesting. Their skills on ground control and speed make the grappling battle very practical for them. Many years ago I wrestled in junior high school for two short years. I was pretty successful, yet by the time I started training Jiu-Jitsu at age 21 I had lost much of those skills. In essence, I think I was much more of a "beginning from scratch" Jiu-Jitsu student rather than coming from an extensive wrestling background. Other than still naturally employing the Gable grip and knowing that I needed to be in side control position, I was very raw on ground technique.

I am interested in this transition and I want to discuss it. One reason is that many of us have wrestling backgrounds. Another is that we have many wrestlers that come in to test the waters of Jiu-Jitsu for a class or two, and never return. A third is that there are two wrestlers that will be fighting for the UFC Heavyweight title in less than two weeks. But I don't think the ground battle between the two will look like an Olympic wrestling match, I think we'll see some employment of Jiu-Jitsu principles, even if its not extensive.

So here are some of my thoughts on the wrestler's transition to Jiu-Jitsu.

Advantages

First, the wrestler comes in with a unique physical strength that is unseen. I once had an argument with a friend about "strength." He was stating that a person who lifts weights is most likely to win in a fight. I argued the opposite, that a wrestler will be much more successful. A wrestler might not develop the muscle tissue that a bodybuilder does, but he will have a different strength in his muscles. It will still be a physical strength, but different. In the end, I told him to go fight a bodybuilder and then fight a wrestler and come back and tell me who is stronger.

Second, the wrestler's balance. Wrestlers have a knack for both manipulating their opponent's balance and of maintaining their own. I love when raw wrestlers come in because they are so difficult to control. Their energy level is amazing. It's a true challenge to employ technique against raw strength. It's just about as close as we can get to having to employ Jiu-Jitsu in a real situation.

Third, wrestlers know how to trust their body movement. So much of grappling is doing what seems counter intuitive (to steal from Conan here). Wrestler's are comfortable being in the positions that seem strange in order to be a successful grappler.

Fourth, wrestlers have amazing speed (both on the feet and on the ground). I'm reminded of watching our wrestlers do the sit out drill we often practice in warm up. Some even do it quicker than Conan. Their hip movement is exceptional.

Disadvantages

Yet I think there are roadblocks. These are not physical challenges, but mental challenges. In so many ways, the wrestler must follow the advice of Yoda, "You must unlearn what you have learned." Understand that this is not a knock on wrestlers (I was indeed a wrestler myself), but some of the challenges I think a wrestler faces.

First, in the beginning it is uncomfortable to consider being on your back. While this subsides eventually, a wrestler becomes comfortable on their back because they realize their advantage in hip movement. The main challenge is in the tendency to give up the back mount in an attempt to get back to the feet because being on your back in wrestling is the worst position to be in.

The second is the tendency to focus on strength instead of technique. Wrestling is much more physical than Jiu-Jitsu. It is much more a match of strength. The wrestler, while employing much technique, is required to exert a lot of strength in successfully applying technique. The story of my brother who is an experience Jiu-Jitsu player that started as a wrestler applies here. My brother was an accomplished wrestler in high school. He took second in state his senior year. He lost very few matches. Although he does not lift weights much anymore, he was brutally strong in high school, setting the school's bench press record at 385 pounds his senior year. I mention these things to emphasize his physical strength. When he started training Jiu-Jitsu about 10 years ago, he was very successful. He even spoke of forcing higher belts to tap while at the blue belt level because of sheer strength. Yet he tells me that his teachers were constantly having to tell him to slow down and think through things instead of going 100 miles an hour if he truly wanted to develop technique. He was exhausting himself and, upon failing to use force, would burn out and eventually be defeated by more technical, patient practitioners. I think we all tend to do this when beginning (whether we're wrestlers or not).

In any case, I think the sheer focus on strength can render skill unable to be employed completely. In essence, it seems that such exertion can lead to forgetting to think through movement and technicalities when we're trying to progress.

In the end, the wrestler's advantages far outweigh the disadvantages. In fact, "far outweigh" is an understatement. I think a wrestler's progression in Jiu-Jitsu can be accelerated many times faster than the Jiu-Jitsu fighters that have no wrestling background.

I'm hoping that the wrestlers in our midst will weigh in on the issue, i.e. Ryan, the Aarons, the Andies (when you say "Andies" do you change the "y" to "ie?" I've never written Andies before. This is an interesting grammar issue. I'm pretty sure it's incorrect. Nonetheless, I'm keeping it for creativity's sake) and of course all others!

5 comments:

Conan said...

I'm also interested in what the wrestlers have to say. Since I was brought up strictly with a Jiu-Jitsu background, I only have my non-scientific observations.

I enjoyed the "creative" style of your writing. For some reason I feel a little bit better about myself when the smarties get stumped. :)

wrstlr3232 said...

Ha well I saw this post and was very interested. I love it, very interesting and made me think about all of it. I agree with everything you said to. I agree 100% about the strength part. Wrestlers tend to have a really weird strength. They don't look very big, but are really strong. I think a lot of it is because so much wrestling has to do with core strength...same with jiu jitsu. I think that also has to do with balance. One big advantage wrestlers have is stand up. As a wrestler I don't focus on take downs as much as because I have been doing it for 10 years. I still try to pick up different take downs, that's one reason I go to judo, so I can expand on what i know. Plus throwing someone is sweet. There are a lot of things we do in warm ups and stuff that I have been doing for a long time too. Sit outs, sprawls, all that stuff is second nature to me now because I have been doing it for so long. You hit the disadvantages right on the head. The first month or so when I was on my back I started to panic and tried getting away, which made it easier for my opponent to get side mount or even mount. Another thing I tend to do incorrect is positioning. Conan has told me many times to under hook the head (when I am in side control) I over hook it like a half nelson. I have worked on that, but tend to still do it incorrectly. Unlearning what I have already learned is tough too. I have to really focus on some of the stuff taught because it is backwards from what I know. That is probably the toughest part. It was kind of funny, the other day I was wrestling with one of our guys and he was taking me down and I pulled guard instead of turning to my stomach.

Ryan

Anonymous said...

I do have a wrestlers background but it's been so long, I'm not sure how much it has helped with my jujitsu training. I think having a wrestlers background can help accelerate the inevitable learning curve in the first few months of jujitsu, since most wrestlers are good with their body control and basic body mechanics. Once I got in shape I found myself hanging with much more experienced jits guys, and my wrestling background undoubtedly helped me do this. To this day, I have good wrist control and understand my body mechanics very well. Sort of along the same lines, I was just asked a few weeks ago if I thought my height and strength helped me out more than the average guy. In some ways yes but it's by no means a golden ticket to success in this sport.

The down side is that we tend to use our strength to much as the article suggests. To this day, I also secretly hate being on my back. I sometimes just "hang out" there and just go with the flow to better acclimate myself to this still foreign position. Jujitsu still comes down to the tiny details that wrestlers don't often have. The learning curve is just as steep in the long run but the beginning it just a little smoother in my opinion. Almost to a fault, I try to be non aggressive and not use my strength to better gain the necessary small details of a submission or sweep. Conan has told me that I am sometimes less explosive than other times and that is when I am trying to concentrate on my form over power. As it stands now, this is the only way I can make it work some days. I also struggle with simple sweeps or ideas in regards to Jujitsu because I still approach things from a wrestling mindset. I struggle more than some realize with even the easy stuff because I am constantly translating the information mentally. This is the most mentally challenging sport I have been a part of because it's so demanding and full of necessary details.


Let's face it, this sport is brutally tough and anyone worth a damn in it has paid their dues regardless of their background. I spend a lot of time learning things on my own and later applying them in class. Conan is a great teacher but I think we are each responsible for our own success or failures. Although I feel my wrestling background has been a definite positive in my transition to jujitsu, my quest to work hard and learn this sport has been tantamount to my minimal success so far.

Andy

Conan said...

It's good to hear Ryan's and Andy's perspectives on this subject so that I can better understand from a teaching perspective.

I couldn't help but feel compelled to respond to Andy's comment about, "...minimal success so far." I realize you're being humble, but also know we're always most critical of ourselves. Where you may see minimal success, I see vast improvement. True statement.

wrstlr3232 said...

In another post Conan talked about how people move through jiu jitsu. They start out new and then hit a big learning curve then plateau then move past it. One thing I thought of when reading Andy's post...(thinking about the way a learning curve works )I think when wrestler starts out they start out higher then someone starting from scratch. After they realize they can't use their strength and some of the techniques used in wrestling I think it is harder to get past that first plateau. Personally, I think I picked up the moves really fast, but I feel like I have been stuck over the past couple months and haven't improved like I did the first couple months. I learned the basic moves really fast, but the small things that make a good jiu jitsu figher has been tough. I think that is another disadvantage for wrestlers.